Open Thread | There Are Questions That Need To Be Answered About Medicare-4-All

One of the most informative bloggers that I have had the privilege of reading is David Anderson from Balloon Juice. For years, he posted under the name Richard Mayhew at Balloon Juice. Nearly all of the clarity and understanding that I have about Obamacare comes from reading his posts.
So, in case you didn’t know, Senator Warren published the substance of her Medicare-4-All plan.

I am not a fan. Never was. Saw it as an unforced error from the beginning.

We haven’t fully supported Obamacare. There’s so much that we could do with the Constitutionally-Approved Obamacare. Healthcare is a positive issue for the Democrats. I saw Medicare-4-All as being a serious unforced error for any Democrat to present.

So, here are two constructive criticisms of Warrant’s Medicare-4-All Plan.

Daringly deceptive: Elizabeth Warren’s Medicare-for-All financing plan is replete with mythical math, constitutional kabuki, and imaginary savings
By Spandan Chakrabarti

Under pressure for months for having refused to release detailed plan to pay for her single-payer, everyone-and-everything-covered government health care plan dubbed “Medicare for All”, Sen. Elizabeth Warren finally released such a plan on Friday. The plan is being highly praised among single-payer ideologues. Some are even trumpeting the fact that she put out a plan at all – the bare minimum that should be expected of someone running for president – as heroic.
I’ll pass.

Warren released a financing plan that is hasty, one that appears designed more to quell the criticism that she doesn’t have a plan to finance her single-payer proposal than to actually pay for her single-payer proposal, and one that looks more like swiss cheese than Swiss healthcare.

The savings from Elizabeth Warren’s single-payer Medicare for All financing plans aren’t even close to what she claims, and the plan won’t raise nearly as much revenue as she hopes.
Let’s delve into the financing plan’s major savings and revenue provisions.

Warren’s financing plan accepts the basic framework of a report published by the Urban Institute last month. The report examined multiple health care coverage expansion ideas, among them three different versions of Medicare for All. The option in that report that most closely resembles Warren’s plan is estimated to cost the federal government an additional $34 trillion over the first decade of implementation.

But Warren says her plan is better and it will require the federal government to raise just $20.5 trillion. How? Warren claims to have found $7 trillion in “savings” and believes that Congress can directly tax state governments to the tune of $6.1 trillion.

Warren fails the administrative cost vs. health care utilization challenge.

Almost $2 trillion in savings in Warren’s plan comes not from an actual policy but from an assumption. Warren’s plan simply assumes that traditional Medicare’s 2.3% administrative cost will remain flat, which allows for a $1.8 trillion in savings against the analysis from the Urban Institute. Having studied the idea, the Urban Institute says that holding administrative costs for Medicare to 2.3% when it is required to cover both everyone and everything, is impractical.

The rest of the article looks cold and hard at the numbers Warren presents to overhaul 1/6 of the American Economy.
For me, it’s the cavalier attitude that she had in response to what will happen to the TWO MILLION PEOPLE that she admits will lose their jobs because of her program. It was blithe. It was dismissive. And, I find that angering, as a Democrat who want to win in 2020.

The second piece is from David Anderson.

218-60-1-5 and the Warren plan
by David Anderson
At 8:49 am on November 4, 2019.

In November 2008, the Senator Max Baucus (D-MT) ,chair of the Senate Finance Committee, released a 98 page white paper. This was a crucial precursor to what eventually became the ACA. Some of the white paper made it into the bill. But that was not why this white paper was important. Instead, it was the last major Democratic choke-point holder laying out what he was willing to do and not do with healthcare reform. With this white paper, all the major Democratic Party actors who held explicit or implicit veto positions were at least onboard with a rigorous exploration of passing an individual market, subsidized and standardized and a major expansion of Medicaid eligibility. There was a pathway forward.

Fast forward to this week. Senator Warren released a Medicare for All plan. It is a plan that won’t get sixty votes in the Senate. It is a plan that will need the approval of Senators Manchin and Sinema. It is a plan that will need 218 votes in the House. In addition to the 218 votes it needs in the House, it also needs a floor slot and committee time. That is problematic.

We talk some about how difficult it would be get a maximalist left-wing agenda through a narrowly divided Senate.

We haven’t talked at all about how difficult it would be to get it through the House, especially with a not especially cooperative Speaker.
— Bill Scher (@billscher) November 2, 2019

Significant elements of the critical pathway to enactment are screaming that they are not interested in another run up the hill of health finance and delivery system transformation. Senators Manchine and Sinema are veto players. Speaker Pelosi is a veto player. They aren’t onboard with the vision that Senator Warren is outlining. This is a major problem if you support Senator Warren (and/or Senator Sander) and her health care plans. Even if she wins, enactment will be extremely unlikely if the rest of the veto players are indifferent at best to it.

The Speaker is trying to tell you. What works in San Francisco doesn’t usually work in Michigan, because we are a diverse country. And, those with the vetoes are telling you that their neck of the woods will not look kindly on this, and that you need to think long and hard before you go down this road. Barack Obama and Nancy Pelosi did what was necessary to get it through the House and the Senate.

They counted the cold, hard votes needed to make this law. We don’t have to like it, but, in order to get it out of the House, Speaker Pelosi has to get it past those members who come from purple districts that enabled the Democrats to take back the House. Ignore those folks and their concerns at your peril.

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109 Responses to Open Thread | There Are Questions That Need To Be Answered About Medicare-4-All

  1. rikyrah says:

    Maura Barrett@MauraBarrettNBC

    Just now on @TheDailyShow
    @JulianCastro responds to @PeteButtigieg’s invitation:

    “I don’t need to go to South Bend. I visited 100 cities as Secretary of HUD and was the mayor of a city 14 times bigger. In fact, we could almost fit South Bend in our Alamo dome.”

  2. rikyrah says:

    Trump nominee worked on illegal plan to deny help to scam victims

    Rachel Maddow reports on a memo that shows that controversial Donald Trump judicial nominee Steven Menashi helped craft an illegal plan to deny debt relief to victims of a scammy for-profit college.

  3. rikyrah says:

    Zeke Miller (@ZekeJMiller) Tweeted:
    !!! DES MOINES, Iowa (AP) — A top aide to Democratic presidential candidate Tom Steyer in Iowa has privately offered campaign contributions to local politicians in exchange for endorsing his White House bid,

  4. rikyrah says:

    Holocaust survivor under guard amid death threats

    An 89-year-old Holocaust survivor in Italy has been assigned police guards for protection after receiving hundreds of threats on social media.

    Liliana Segre, who was sent to the notorious Auschwitz death camp at 13, has been subjected to a barrage of anti-Semitic messages in recent days.

    It comes after Ms Segre, an Italian life senator, called for parliament to establish a committee to combat hate.

    The motion passed despite a lack of support by Italy’s right-wing parties.

    Members of the nationalist League party, led by Matteo Salvini, the centre-right Forza Italia and the far-right Brothers of Italy all abstained from the vote in Milan last week.

    The motion called for the establishment of an extraordinary commission in Italy to combat all forms of racism, anti-Semitism, incitement to hatred and violence on ethnic and religious grounds.

    Ms Segre said after the vote that the abstentions made her feel “like a Martian in the Senate”.

  5. rikyrah says:

    Archie is CRAWLING and has two teeth! Proud Harry and Meghan share details of six-month-old son as they pay tribute to military families who ‘hold it together back home’ while partners serve abroad

    Prince Harry has praised those who maintain a home life while their partner is away on operations
    He sympathised with service personnel missing out on child’s development while serving abroad
    Meghan tells military families that six-month-old Archie is beginning to crawl and has two teeth
    Couple met families from the Welsh Guards, Coldstream Guards and Household Cavalry in Windsor
    They visited coffee morning at Broom Farm Community Centre in the heart of Army housing estate

    PUBLISHED: 04:11 EST, 7 November 2019 | UPDATED: 09:02 EST, 7 November 2019

  6. rikyrah says:

    Folks, Europe no longer thinks Trump is a one-off and the US will return to being the standard bearer of the West. They are ready to move on without us. Basically, you can forget superpower status. It’s done.Happy Thursday!— Alex Finley (@alexzfinley) November 7, 2019

  7. rikyrah says:

    This muthaphucka, here!!
    The damn nerve!!

    GOP senator rips into Pelosi at Trump rally: ‘It must suck to be that dumb’
    BY JUSTIN WISE – 11/07/19 07:45 AM EST

    Sen. John Kennedy (R-La.) launched into a blistering attack against Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) while speaking at a Trump campaign rally in Louisiana late Wednesday, stating that it “must suck” to be as “dumb” as her.

    “In three short years, President Trump has doubled the growth in the greatest economy in all of human history. And do you know what our Democratic friends have done for him?” Kennedy asked. “Speaker Nancy Pelosi is trying to impeach him.”

  8. rikyrah says:

    I know it’s the Daily Mail, but…….
    just hope Omar’s ducks are in a row….

    EXCLUSIVE: Newly divorced Ilhan Omar faces investigation over taking her lover on trips paid by her campaign, as the Federal Election Commission is asked to examine at least $369k in payments made to the married aide

    Minnesota Congresswoman Ilhan Omar is facing an investigation over taking her lover Tim Mynett on trips that were paid for by her campaign
    The conservative National Legal and Policy Center last month filed an amended version of a complaint lodged earlier into Omar’s campaign spending
    The group is asking the Federal Election Commission to investigate payments made by Omar’s campaign to Mynett’s company, The E Street Group
    Ilhan’s campaign paid Mynett’s company more than $369,000 since hiring him in August of 2018 up until this past September
    Nearly $25,000 is labeled as travel expenses, according to records
    ‘If Ilhan for Congress reimbursed Mynett’s LLC for travel so that Rep. Omar would have the benefit of Mynett’s romantic companionship, the expenditure must be considered personal in nature,’ according to the complaint
    Omar’s divorce from husband Ahmed Hirsi became final this week, while Mynett’s wife Beth has also filed for divorce in the wake of the affair

    PUBLISHED: 11:46 EST, 6 November 2019 | UPDATED: 11:57 EST, 6 November 2019

  9. rikyrah says:

    Someone is putting billboards up in SC with Lindsay Graham tweets.

  10. rikyrah says:

    👑 Black Professor 👑 (@Wonderbitch82) Tweeted:
    Kamala Harris proposes keeping schools open for 10 hours a day.

    I’m so supportive of this policy.

    I did my senior thesis in college on this topic.

    Crime and violence spike between 3pm to 6pm in urban communities because adolescents are normally roaming the streets.

  11. rikyrah says:

    Courtney 🖤🦅 (@Sludgeycourt) Tweeted:
    Faux progressives don’t like Kamala Harris’s plans because they focus on righting systematic wrongs for disenfranchised people on an achievable scale, which doesn’t often include white upper class dudes.


  12. rikyrah says:

    Michael Carpenter (@mikercarpenter) Tweeted:
    Looks like Giuliani helped broker two quid pro quos:

    1. with Poroshenko, selling Javelins in return for freezing investigations of Manafort;

    2. with Zelensky, demanding investigations of VP Biden for military aid and a WH mtg.

    He only got 1 of 2.

  13. rikyrah says:

    The crazyfication factor strikes again 😒😒😒

    Stuart Rothenberg (@StuPolitics) Tweeted:
    In latest NBC/WSJ poll, 27% of respondents say Trump is “honest and trustworthy.” Also, 27% say he has “high personal and ethical standards.”

    • eliihass says:


      For the record, black voters have also been known to show up en masse and have in fact helped propel non-black candidates they deem worthy, to a win-

      But more importantly, ‘black candidates’ aren’t all created equal..

      No matter extensive favorable coverage, not all ‘black candidates’ have what it actually takes to capture, hold the attention and most importantly, excite black voters – or even more importantly, get them to the polls.. And contrary to some of the chatter, it isn’t for ‘lack of name recognition’ or because they’ve had ‘negative’ media …or are being ‘erased’..

      Also, while paid influencer supporters of ‘black candidates’ in current slate are whinging, as far as I know, none of the current ‘black candidates’ have been hung in effigy, none have been called ape/monkey/gorilla, none have been labeled a ‘tranny’, told that the kids they birth are ‘adopted’.. None have been so unrelentingly and so very personally dehumanized in ways that’d bring most people to their knees..

      Actually, the current ‘black candidates’ have the added advantage of having ‘favor’ with, and the effusive support of ‘friends’ like Scarborough, Hugh Hewitt etc. some of the very worst actors in the media …same malign media so often incredibly hostile to the Obamas.. (there’s a reason the historic FLOTUS charted and continues to chart her own path right around and over the media);

      Joe, Mika et al still never pass up on a chance to skewer the Obamas.. something they’ve never done to any of the current ‘black candidates’..

      If these candidates aren’t ‘catching on’, it isn’t for lack of favorable coverage..

      The current slate of Dem candidates – black and white – are certainly more palatable than Vlad’s treasonous buffoon, but truth is that they are in fact lackluster..

      Ripping off, ‘finessing’, repackaging, and photo-op/staging what is glaringly straight out of easily pegged 11 years worth of the Obamas’ authentic interactions, from the heart speeches, interviews, campaign routines, etc..

      And trying to force-feed voters that recognizably recycled stuff, is not only lame and quite an insult to people’s intelligence, but also rather hilarious to those who see right through the desperately superficial and endless mimicry..

  14. rikyrah says:

    Democrats wiped out Republican control of three suburban Philadelphia counties Tuesday. Including Delaware County, which has been home to one of the most formidable GOP machines in the U.S. Columnist @panaritism says that means Trump is on borrowed time.— The Philadelphia Inquirer (@PhillyInquirer) November 6, 2019

  15. rikyrah says:

    Sunday night #Scarborough bus story: Two women in hijabs sit across from each other. They look at each other. Finally they speak, quietly, shyly. After a few exchanges, tears start to flow and they become very excited, hugging and jumping up and down. >>— Marjorie Chan | 陳以珏 (@magicalmudge) 4 November 2019

  16. rikyrah says:

    Trump officials wanted Ukraine to implicate Bidens

    Trump officials proposed to Ukraine that its statement on corruption include an investigation into the Bidens, and Congressman Jamie Raskin weighs in on the implications.

  17. rikyrah says:

    Chris Hayes: Yes, there was a quid pro quo

    Gordon Sondland’s testimony reveals Trump was, without question, demanding a quid pro quo from Ukraine.

  18. rikyrah says:

    This is a good segment.

    Diplomats’ texts lay out Trump Ukraine scheme in stark detail

    Rachel Maddow reports on newly published transcripts of text messages between Kurt Volker, Gordon Sondland and others, in which Donald Trump’s demand for investigations into Joe Biden’s son and a debunked conspiracy theory in exchange for foreign aid and a White House meeting for Ukraine are discussed in plain terms, even as Sondland made late changes to his testimony to the Donald Trump impeachment committees.

  19. rikyrah says:

    UH HUH
    UH HUH

    UK prime minister withholding report on Russia’s role in Brexit

    Rachel Maddow reports on a controversy in the UK in which Prime Minister Boris Johnson is blocking the release of a report on Russian interference in the Brexit vote until after the general election scheduled for December.
    Nov. 6, 2019

  20. rikyrah says:

    Sondland revises House testimony, now recalls Trump quid pro quo

    Rep. Eric Swalwell, member of the House Intelligence Committee, talks with Rachel Maddow about progress in the Trump impeachment inquiry and the increasing amount of witness testimony that points to Donald Trump attempting to extort Ukraine with military aid and a White House meeting in a quid pro quo for personal favors.

  21. rikyrah says:

    Roger Stone trial begins with characteristic chaos

    Rachel Maddow reports on the beginning of the Roger Stone trial with jury selection interrupted by a medical emergency and Stone leaving early complaining of food poisoning.
    Nov. 5, 2019

  22. rikyrah says:

    Two Somali women, Safiya Khalid and Nadia Mohamed, win two seats in Lewiston City Council in Maine and Park City in St. Louis. Safia and Nadia thus become the first two Muslim women on the municipal council of these two cities in United States.

    — Almamy Kalumanzillaa™※ (@AlmamyMoha) November 6, 2019

  23. rikyrah says:


    That is the number of people who have been denied the franchise due to felony convictions that the Governor-Elect of Kentucky says that he will restore their voting rights.



  24. rikyrah says:

    Someone on another blog has made this point about Virginia:

    It was black people that held steady in Virginia and didn’t allow Ralph Northam or Justin Fairfax to get pushed out…and now with a Dem majority in both houses, can enact and protect legislation that helps all Virginians.

    Yep Yep Yep

  25. Liza says:

    Tucson!! All the city council seats up for election were won by Democrats (not unusual for Tucson).

  26. rikyrah says:

    Good Morning,Everyone 😄😄😄

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